Sgt_Mike
Well-known member
There is nothing wrong with complaining about the ride to the shared destination. We all have differing viewpoints on how the journey should be to the shared destination.
Iranian Uprising
- Thread starter Stu Farish
- Start date
Maybe some don’t have a choice—but let’s not pretend that explains all of it.
Those people didn’t look like a crowd being herded at gunpoint. They were waving flags, bringing their kids, standing there like they wanted to be there. That’s not fear—that’s buy-in. Looks like the same crowds that screamed death to America and Israel. They weren’t rounding people up at gunpoint before the war to get those crowds to scream that when they weren’t staring down incoming U.S. airstrikes—simply write that off and simplify it to that if you want.
You don’t get families showing up like that with rifles at their backs. That’s what nationalism looks like—people choosing to stand in front of something because they believe in it.
Fear can make people comply. It doesn’t make them show up proud.
Exactly—most Americans can’t really comprehend the raw power of faith and belief when it’s taken to that level. It might be a twisted ideology from our perspective, but underestimating the kind of sacrifice people will make in the name of belief is a serious mistake.
Even in Christianity, there’s the idea that judgment involves the condition of the heart and intent, not just outward action. So the question becomes—what’s in the heart of someone willing to become a suicide bomber? Light or dark? From their perspective, they’re martyrs in a holy war—they believe they’re carrying out what is right. That’s what makes ideological warfare so dangerous: it closes the gap between conviction and action.
And people also tend to overlook the real-world impact of modern warfare. When infrastructure gets hit, even when it’s tied to military logistics or dual-use systems, the people who feel it most are often civilians just trying to live normal lives working there. Not everyone affected is part of the fight, but they still end up carrying the weight of it. Losing their livelihood.
At that point, it becomes simple reality—when a country is under attack, a significant portion of the population will see it as their duty to resist and defend their homeland.
You’ll absolutely have segments of the population that would welcome us, that’s true in almost every conflict. But you’ll also have a meaningful number of civilians willing to fight to the end if boots hit the ground—regular insurgents, organized militant groups, and ideological fighters- mujahideen, alongside broader sectarian factions that emerge or intensify once the conflict takes hold on the ground level.
Then you layer in existing military forces, insurgent networks, and outside fighters drawn into the conflict, and it quickly escalates into something far more complex than conventional war on paper suggests.
Could our side inflict more damage militarily? Of course,. but the cost on both sides’ compounds over time, and the endurance of that kind of conflict is what people consistently underestimate. I don’t think the history of American’s will has the stomach to see a fight like that to the end, at least not on our homeland.
Unfortunately, you can still see Trump insisting we “won” because 1,300 targets were destroyed. Yet his words overlook the more uncertain reality, replaced instead with vague claims about “finishing the job” and recovering “nuclear dust.” At one point, even Trump said Iran would help facilitate that process.
And so now we are improvising outcomes as we go— as some modern-day vigilante pirates with no clear end state. No real telling where this little journey leads next. Short memories all around, and a willingness to treat each new claim the same way as the last, no matter how inconsistent it becomes.
And so now we are improvising outcomes as we go— as some modern-day vigilante pirates with no clear end state. No real telling where this little journey leads next. Short memories all around, and a willingness to treat each new claim the same way as the last, no matter how inconsistent it becomes.
Does anyone know what the strategy, the goal of the blockade is?
We lifted sanctions on Russian oil (Putin's gotta hope this war never ends he's gorging himself on money right now), and have also been allowing Iran to export their oil up to this point too. To "soften" the impact on the price of oil.
If we are now going to block the export of Iranian oil, to what purpose? To get them to negotiate? That will take at least a year. We're going to keep this up for another year or more? I'm sure Iran, even if the have a thought to negotiation, will keep the pain going until after the mid-terms. Like the start of the war, I honestly don't know what the strategy is or the end goal. I've never heard Trump give a coherent consistent answer.
- DAA
We lifted sanctions on Russian oil (Putin's gotta hope this war never ends he's gorging himself on money right now), and have also been allowing Iran to export their oil up to this point too. To "soften" the impact on the price of oil.
If we are now going to block the export of Iranian oil, to what purpose? To get them to negotiate? That will take at least a year. We're going to keep this up for another year or more? I'm sure Iran, even if the have a thought to negotiation, will keep the pain going until after the mid-terms. Like the start of the war, I honestly don't know what the strategy is or the end goal. I've never heard Trump give a coherent consistent answer.
- DAA
spotstalkshoot
Well-known member
My desire, the blockade/ creasefire gives Iran the time to expose more targets(hard and soft) for our military to destroy. Another 1000 air strikes could be the "learing" lesson the remaining 12'ers need about holding the world hostage.
FWIW most iranians are not moslems. Mosques have been closing due to lack of attendance
About 80% of Iran is Shia Muslim. And the Sunni and Shia fight each other over who is the boss (one allows an elected boss, the other must be a descendant of Mohamoud - there really are NONE - he killed most). US is going after the $ Iran gets from oil. Actually any funds that go to the 'gov.' as all of that goes out of country or for weapons.
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This is exactly where America keeps miscalculating—assuming more force leads to submission. It doesn’t. “1000 more airstrikes as a lesson” isn’t strategy—it’s a misunderstanding of how asymmetric warfare bleeds time and resources. History is full of examples where that thinking didn’t end conflicts; it prolonged them into exactly what was trying to be avoided.
If you're born in Iran, they put moslem on your passport. regardless of if you are or not, you & your family have no say in it. Listen to people who live there, most are not actually moslems. This isn't Iraq
Iran is still absolutely Muslim—about 90%+ Shia with a small Sunni minority—not “mostly non-Muslim.” The Sunni–Shia split isn’t a modern political fight over “who’s boss,” but a historical dispute over leadership succession after Muhammad, not a simplistic “elections vs killing rivals” narrative.
That religious structure is embedded in their government, led by clerics under the Supreme Leader—it reflects institutionalized religion, not a collapsed or largely abandoned faith.
At the same time, real power inside the system is fragmented, with the IRGC “holding a gun to the head” making decisions on security and policy decisions and operating like a state within a state, which is part of what makes negotiation with Iran so complex.
That religious structure is embedded in their government, led by clerics under the Supreme Leader—it reflects institutionalized religion, not a collapsed or largely abandoned faith.
At the same time, real power inside the system is fragmented, with the IRGC “holding a gun to the head” making decisions on security and policy decisions and operating like a state within a state, which is part of what makes negotiation with Iran so complex.
Who decides Sunni or Shia—your passport or your beliefs?
In reality, neither the state nor paperwork decides it—Sunni or Shia identity is based on family tradition and personal belief, not government labeling.
steve garrett
Well-known member
we have heard for years about the supposed effects of sanctions on countries. I think in effect and in practice its almost like a tarriff because outside goods are super expensive or impossible to get. On the ground in Iran oil and gas are fractions of what we pay. This means their citizens get to enjoy fuel prices we would consider basically free. for example in my view if their oil was subject to open market pricing their residents would suffer major pricing shock. I think the sanctions have had the reverse effect. its propped up iranian industry to supply their own residents with goods and products. They are basically self sufficient because the sanctions made them have to be so.
its funny this topic comes up here. I don't often get too sustentative about things. but it really bugs me when the people that autta know better just don't. on another forum I post alot on. I predicted all of what we are seeing when the war broke out. The people there were all trump this that. 10d chess etc. told me I am a trump hater etc. The main forum I post on I just had to take a break from and realized its better for me, I may not go back. The people there are no better than the left we can't reason with.
The truth is the war has been a disaster. Iran feels no need to agree to anything right now and why would they? Its like spanking a 6 year old over and over again and they look up at you and say that didn't hurt! or So what when you get mad I guess I will just get spanked again should I schedule it for 4 pm tomorrow? I believe we made a terrible error with iran and to another extent russia. The key to influence in these countries is normalization of trade and relations. if they are buying our products and we buying theirs and our economies are open to each other. I feel that is far far FAR more influence than isolation that hasn't worked for 45 years. Some people I listen to that have been right over the years, they are suggesting Trump is having some health and mental issues. Trump is acting very erratic the last 6 months on pretty much everything. I know he has been accused of that for years. History will write the truth one day.
"Iran feels no need to agree to anything right now " When Iran does capitulate, the Iranian people will take over. Just like Putin, if he quits with Ukraine, he's DONE. If Iranian leaders give up the 'nuke' they are DONE.
Edit: Interesting - Italy PM is 'leaning' toward the EU (aka, being blackmailed). Pope met with Axelrod JUST before the Pope and Cardinals came out against Trump. Hmm.
Edit: Interesting - Italy PM is 'leaning' toward the EU (aka, being blackmailed). Pope met with Axelrod JUST before the Pope and Cardinals came out against Trump. Hmm.
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Rhett Steele
Active member
I posted this in the democrat thread. Im sure it'll get a laugh or two here as well.
spotstalkshoot
Well-known member
Except Iran has PROMISED to kill all Christians and Jewish people, destroy western civilization. The leaders do not want to do "business" with the west. The 12'ers WANT a pre Christian world and the religious purge(murder,rape,slavery) is allowed and rewarded.
If Iran’s goal was to kill all Christians, Jews, or “infidels,” you’d expect that to start within its own borders. But those communities still exist there, are legally recognized, and even have representation—while facing discrimination, not extermination. Iran’s hostility toward the U.S. and Israel is rooted more in decades of conflict, sanctions, regime change fears, and opposition to Israel after the 1979 revolution than in a goal of global religious genocide.
Think about it, Iran’s allies don’t really match the idea of a simple religious extermination agenda. Some of its closest regional relationships and partnerships involve countries and governments that are not uniformly Muslim-majority or are religiously diverse, such as Armenia and Syria. That further shows the conflict is driven more by geopolitical strategy and regional power interests than by a goal of targeting all non-Muslims.
Trump says China agreed to stop sending weapons and air defense to Iran—and will give him a big fat hug when he goes to see him.
We still doing the “just trust it” thing?
Yeah… I’m sure we can all sleep better now, lol
We still doing the “just trust it” thing?
Yeah… I’m sure we can all sleep better now, lol