Kimber, Browning, or Remington (long with lots of questions)

broknaero

broknaero

New member
Kimber M8400 Montana 7mm WSM, (1st choice)
Browning Stainless stalker 7mm WSM, (2nd choice)
Remington Model 700 Alaskan Ti 7mm Rem Mag. (3rd choice would be 1st if came in 7mm short)
or
Remington MODEL 700 Sendero SF II 7mm Rem mag, (4th choice)

What would you pick for an all purpose any weather rifle, and why? Anyone have one of these? Pros and Cons please.

This rifle will be the all purpose not specializing in 1 thing but must be accurate and ruggid! In 3 months I go to Kodiak for Sitka Blacktail and Blackbear. When I get back from that in a month I go for Quebec Carabou. Next year it may be pronghorn, mule deer, or elk out west or moose in Maine depending on what tags I draw. I'm looking for a quality synthetic stock, Stainless rust proof barrel 24". Needs to handle all weather types, temperature extreams, salt water spray in Alaska and Mountains in the west to Texas and Mexico.

Will be used on all types of North American deer , pronghorn, carabou, blackbear, sheep, goats, elk and maybe moose.

I already have a .325WSM so getting a .300 mag is kind of pointless. I have only hunted as far as big game whitetails and blackbear. Now financialy I am able to hunt anywhere but would like a long range do-it-all rifle (I know one doesnt really exist but its fun to pretend).

My current big game rifles are .220 swift( yes there are species of CXP2 game this is perfect for), .243, .260, .308, .325WSM, .35 rem, .350 Rem Mag So you can see I have room for a nice long range 7mm Mag. I'm also ordering a .375 Ruger but thats pretty much for Africa only (If I can handle the recoil).

So I know we mainly talk about small calibers here, but I need some advice on whats going on in the rest of the country. Theres a lot of experiance on here that I trust. I know some of you guys go on some of these hunts I mentioned. What do you reccomend?
 
I would certainly avoid the WSMs. Other than that you have already made up your mind.
I really question a 3 month time frame unless you are going to do all the work yourself. At the very least you need a good pillar bedding job. Most better gunsmiths would be hard pressed to do even that in less than 3 months.

Jack
 
Out of those choices,I would go with the Sendero SFII in 7mm Mag. I'm not a fan of the wsm. My best friend lived in Alaska for 35 years and went to Kodiak often, mainly to hunt blacktails. I don't know if you know much about it, but it's brutal. I would definitely have a strong stock and quality scope.
 
Of those I'd go with the Kimber due to controlled feed/manual ejector. However I would prefer something else and a different caliber, I am not a fan of 7mms or short mags. If I was to go with a 7mm it would be the "express" or what ever name it has now, basicly the 30/06 case with 7mm bullets.
Carl
 
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The 7mm Express Bofire is referring to is a .280. Remington switched names a couple times with it, and eventually settled on just ".280." I'd recommend the Remington Alaskan Ti in .280, like Bofire said, because it is a 7mm in reality(.284), but kicks less than the 7mm magnums, and gives excellent balistics. I think it would serve you well. Good luck in whatever you do get though!
 
I'm bored so here is my cheap opinion. I wouldn't plunk down my money for any of those rifles. The 7mm is ok and I have stayed away from the WSM's for many reasons, one being stubborn. The .280 is an ok round but has limits especially if you don't reload. We sold a .280 because it was nearly impossible to get more than one bullet choice off the shelf locally. The boring .30-06 solved that problem well. When heading out away from home it is good to have a popular caliber that you can purchase off the shelf in case something goes wrong. That salt water can ruin almost anything. Stainless steel rifles are not immune from rust. A magnet will not stick to high grade stainless but a magnet will stick to every stainless barrel we have tried. My understanding is the higher grade stainless has a higher percentage of nickel. Good Luck
 
I have a 300 WSM and a 7mm WSM and love them both!!! I'd check it out for yourself before you listen to someone who hasnt owned one and is only going on opinions including brass and factory ammo cost more. Flat out the ballistic on WSMs are better than regular mags. It may not be much better but ITS BETTER (except with the 25 WSM which should of never been made) !!!
 
Kimber, Sako, TIkka, Dakota Arms, and a Remington ammo company took up with the WSM's for some reason. Must be cause they are terrible rounds and have no place in the future. right??? Short Mag Haters???? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/angry-smiley-055.gif
 
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I have no reason to hate the short mags but for the caliber I may be interested in there is a bullet weight limit that is not a problem for the long version. There have also been feeding problems with some. My neighbor missed a shot at a trophy buck on camera while on a guided hunt. He was shooting a brand new short mag. Could have happened with another caliber but that doesn't excuse it. Thompson Center Arms has avoided WSM's because of the high pressures. I also have a couple friends that are happy with them. Ammo here is generally a little more within a couple dollars. We did see one that was actually cheaper but may have been unsold from previous pricing. So it's not all good or all bad but there is nothing wrong with the time tested long versions that have been around forever either.
 
BHLBAMA, I dont hate any caliber, that is a silly idea. I have several ballistic books and can find no evidence, that is from an independant source, that supports your claim. The 300 Win Mag. has 7-10% more powder capacity than the 300 WSM. I know nothing about the 7mm WSM, I did use a 7mm Rem. Mag. for many years.

If you think the companies you name or any others have any interest other than selling guns, WAKE UP. Do you think the companies selling new things try to 'pump them up' a bit or use the 'best results' rather than the most consistant?
Rifles last folks forever, if there is no "new thing" to generate more sales guess what happens.
CD
 
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Thanks for the Advice guys. I do already have 1 WSM so I know what I'm getting into. I know its a touchy subject with most folks. I hear the logic behind something in a caliber I can buy ammo for anywhere incase of an emergancy.
I guess I just need to flip a coin.
I am considering a H-S Precision rifle in 7mm WSM. It fits what I'm looking for, gaurenteed 1/2 MOA , and I can put my hands on it tonight if I wanted. A rifle like that shouldnt need any bedding. But neither should the Kimber.

Thanks guys, you all made good points for me to think about!
 
broknero, good luck man I hope what ever you get shoots like crazxy!~!!
Those HS rifles look sweet!!

Carl, aint new rifles fun!!!
 
brokeanro,

I read your selection of calibers you already own and IMO your choice of the 7mmWSM does fill your "void"...almost. Just from a marketing standpoint the
7mmWSM may still be in production as a rifle chambering from the major domestic manufacturers for 3 years..4 tops. Ammo and brass will be available on likely a semi-annual run basis. While I agree with you the 7mm is a fine round it will not do anything a 270WSM won't do with "premium" bullets.

We had enough 7mm carthridges,the 7mmWSM was not needed...the 270WSM
was the "sleeper" introduction and here to stay. The game to be hunted criteria you outlined in your post the 270 WSM fills the "void" quite nicely.


Hog
 
I think I agree with Hoginator on this one for the most part since you already have a 325 WSM .
I have a Kimber 8400 Montana in 300 WSM . I was ( kind of like you ) looking for a very versital kind of do it all rifle . I chose the rifle for it's light weight because I carry my hunting rifles more than I shoot them and I chose the 300 WSM for the wide range of bullets and bullet weights that are available in .30 caliber .
The Kimber shoots well and is a joy to carry , I really like it .
 
I've taken 3 Browning Stainless Stalkers to Alaska on 3 out of 4, fly in, backpack trips. Two 300 WSM's and a 7mm WSM. The 7mm I used to take a Dall sheep and the 300's took caribou. As you can see from my handle I love Rugers, but I have never had any brand of firearm shoot so accurately right out of the box as these Brownings. And rugged they are, even though some say differently. All I can say is these three brought the bacon home for me. I trust them with my life forty miles from the nearest human. Go with the 7mm WSM IMHO.
 
Broknaero,

The bore diameter difference betwen the .270 and .284 is .007. Do you think the 'wound channel" sizes are going to be different???

I think not.

As the politicians use to say..It's the economy stupid. For us hunters," It's the bullet stupid."

Hog
 
I think the pure shock from a 7mm WSM or 7mm Rem Mag will for sure be make a larger wound channel than a regular 270 not matter if it was .001 larger. Maybe not as much difference when comparing a 270 WSM but that was not in the orginal topic in this post.
 
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BHLBAMA, I dont hate any caliber, that is a silly idea. I have several ballistic books and can find no evidence, that is from an independant source, that supports your claim. The 300 Win Mag. has 7-10% more powder capacity than the 300 WSM. I know nothing about the 7mm WSM, I did use a 7mm Rem. Mag. for many years.

If you think the companies you name or any others have any interest other than selling guns, WAKE UP. Do you think the companies selling new things try to 'pump them up' a bit or use the 'best results' rather than the most consistant?
Rifles last folks forever, if there is no "new thing" to generate more sales guess what happens.
CD



I'm AWAKE NOW!!! Winchester and Remington websites both have the 300WSM out performing the 300 WIn mag. Not sure why you think a independant company would have any different results. I agree since WInchester started the cartridge I might agree with your thinking but Remington has no reason to stretch the ballistics. Remingtons ballistics chart claims that with the 150 gr. corelokt 300 win mag velocity is 3290 to the 300 WSM 3320 and the muzzle energy is 3605 to the 300 WSM 3671. SO like I said it may not be much. But with your info on the 7-10 % less powder in the WSM it just proves the point more on out performing the standard mag.
 
I ran Winchester Supreme 180 grain 300 win mag, thru two rifles, 1 remington and 1 Tikka, and I ran 180 grain Supreme, 300WSM thru a chrono, from a Remington rifle, the rem. started out as a super short and was rechambered to 300wsm.

rifle 1. 300 win mag.: 5 rounds/10feet. 2955, 2963, 2960, 2966, 2953.
rifle 2. 300win mag.: 5rounds/10feet. 2951, 2962, 2967, 2959, 2968.


Rifle 1, 300wsm: 5 rounds/10feet. 2890, 2900, 2893, 2907, 2911.

I have never tried a factory load that did what the factory said. Now I freely admit that this is a very sparce sample and there is not enough data to form any conclusions.
Hornady book #6th. edition shows:
180 grain bullet.

WSM- 80 grains of AA Magpro= 3000fps

300W Mag- 76.9 grains AA Magpro= 3000fps.

Sierra, 5th edition: 180 grain.
WSM, RE-22, max load of 71 grains at 3000fps.
W.Mag RE-22, max load 74.8 grains for 3100fps.

hmmmmm???? more efficient? I think not. Every Manual I own shows the same thing. I have never tried this AA Magpro powder, but it was the one load that was identical in that manual.
That said, you are right that the difference means nothing on game performance.
Carl
 
1) Kimber has more QC problems with their bolt guns right now than I, or they, can remember. It's a nightmare to be sure. Too bad, cuz i like the blue-print/idea, and that they are American made. It's about 50/50, with no exaggeration, of gettin' a POS that will have to be returned for "repairs" right now..........

2) Browning A-bolt: absolute biggest POS out there.....an accident waiting to happen...'nuff said.......

3) Rem Ti........good gun in virtually all respects, but with a little homework, you can slap together a custom for real close to the same price with a better barrel........
 


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