The Shooting in Oregon..

The first video I watched had several 'cuts' in it where either the camera was turned off or it was edited. We are seeing what the Feds want us to see. From their narrative it does look like Finicum was reaching for his 'off'side. I guess if I was carrying a concealed weapon I would carry it on my strong side. From the 'silent' video it's impossible to tell if shots were fired before the fatal shot. And like Ornery said he could have been grabbing a bullet wound in his left side. All of you try to draw a weapon out of your off side jacket pocket and see how that goes. It just isn't natural. The LEO that ran out in front of Finicum's SUV right at the start wasn't run over, dumb move on his part to get in front of a vehicle like that. I think we all need a little more information. This video could either show a fools reaction to the situation or an assassination.
 
Originally Posted By: Orneryolfart357Amazing how many times the story has changed. The driver of the Jeep that was freed released his video saying that the Rancher rushed the cops. That was not true by watching this video. The 18 year old girl in the truck said they were being riddled with bullets. With no audio its hard to tell what the Rancher was actually doing. Had he already been shot and reaching for the wound? So many unanswered questions. Why did the Cop jump out in front of the truck? Was he already shooting the windshield? We may never get the real story. Where are the body cam videos, Dash cam etc? It is what it is I guess.

The story didn't change. Ya'll were just getting information from people who weren't there and you don't realize watch your watching. Perhaps ya should read the FBI's explanation of what they are showing and what led to the crash.

They knew darn well who was in what vehicle before they attempted the stop.

They tried to stop him before he got to the road block. He was attempting to evade. You can tell by the impact he is hauling a$$.

He was the only one who bailed out of the car. Once again trying to evade.

My guess is the officer they almost hit was sitting behind the truck and probably thought he was going to crash right into the parked vehicles. Should he sit there an wait to be crushed by the impact or be in a position to where he could bail over the snow bank. He didn't know what direction he was going to drive this vehicle.

They know he is armed and has made threats. He makes movements consistent with reaching for a weapon.

They riddle the the truck with OC munition and it looks like flash bangs going.

Even if they did shoot at the vehicle (I bet they didn't) while it was coming at them, they would be justified in do so.

They could have all the video in the world but people are still going to see what they want to see. This is like watching an NFL game on TV and expecting the ref's to see the same thing you do from ground level.
 
when you say "they'll never take me alive" or words to that effect, it may well be more of a prophetic statement than anything else.
 
Ok, if you're planning a defense are you going to carry on your off side...no...if you're a cop are you going to jump in front of a moving vehicle......no......if you're the cops planning an assassination are you going to surround the guy and cover all areas....yes....if planning an assassination would you have any problem with shooting a man in the back..no....and finally, are you going to believe anything the government spews out.....NO. We will never hear the absolute truth from our government spin machine. They never intended for this man to live.
 
Stories did change. Veronica was there.. in the truck and she gave the audio in one of the earlier posts in the first Bundy thread. The Guy driving the Jeep was Not there at the shooting. He said in his video after being released that the other woman in the truck said that the Rancher charged to police. The video we see here shows him holding his arms up as Veronica stated in her audio report. Those are 2 conflicting stories.
 
I watched the video several times.. I saw a man standing in the snow with no one within 10 feet of him. I saw him with his hands up and then it looked like he doubled over, and was clutching at something, and then it looked like someone came running out of the woods and delivered the final kill shot.

I would be very interested to see if he was hit in the side that he clutched. If that is the case it looks like murder.

But, then again I stop and ask myself.. Why are they setting up road blocks, kicking the media out, and arresting people out in the woods in the snow. Is the occupation of a crap little building on a nature preserve really something the FBI needs to be there for? So what if they are there.
Let them sit out there and rail against the government in the snow in the middle of no where. Collecting them up and arresting them, for what? Is what they were doing really at the level of needing to arrest them all, set up road blocks, and deadly force?

If you think it is, then why didn't they do anything like that in ferguson, balitmore, and so on..
They let the ghetto thugs burn the streets and loot and riot.. But a handful of cowboys.. SHoot them.
Better question is why is it when libtards are in office, only ghetto thugs are allowed to protest and the rest are shot.
 
^^^ I don't understand that either Tbone. Unless,Riots in Ferguson,Baltimore Ect.= no money involved. But what would a peckerwood in the woods know about such things.If a man believed the stories about the Ruskies and minerals and money and mines then he might get to thinking that some people who had taken money were under pressure to get this resolved.But who would believe such stuff as that.
 
This is the unedited video. Encounter starts at 9:15



I'd like to see better video if it's available, especially with audio so we could here what's said & what shots are fired & when.
 
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I also would like a video with some audio, very hard to tell if he is shot and grabs at the wound before the guy comes out of the woods and what looks like finishes him off.
 
Originally Posted By: Orneryolfart357A lot of people will enter their views of the Video. Should this man have died?

That's typically what happens when you get shot. Reach into your coat when being apprehended and you will likely get shot.

Had his hands stayed in the air and been there when he got shot that would be murder...

He clearly reached down and into his coat, any cop on the planet should have made that shot.

Video saves the day where eyewitness accounts are biased and less than accurate. Videos are starting to prove that witness's words all too often don't mean very much. It's too easy for people to believe what they want and side with whichever side they happen to believe in. A witness can tell any story and there are those who will buy it and those who won't, people on the sidelines that didn't actually see an event have no way of knowing what happened for sure. Video can be and is becoming the ultimate controversy breaker.

Now the interesting thing is that had the shooting clearly been unjustified would we have ever seen that FBI drone footage? Makes one wonder doesn't it? I personally don't think we'd have ever known it existed. Police departments (some) are trying to make the case that their video records are for their internal use only and would like to not release them when they prove wrongdoing. The FBI would have sat on that video had the victims hands stayed in the air.
 
looks like a drone feed to me.. When exactly do you think you have had a "routine" traffic stop with a drone overhead and ready?

In the middle of no where? By two FBI vehicles. Oh, wait, is it within the perview of the FBI to enforce state trafic laws? No
If it was a rountine stop, as we were told, why would the drone focus on another vehicle that isn't being stopped?

When was the last time you saw a rountine traffic stop with two vehicles and what looks like at least 6 swat guys or more?

If it was a routine traffic stop, how did they have a road block set up so fast and some dude up in the tree's?

I don't buy the Fed line at all. IMO
 
I agree Tbone. According to what I read the Drone was taking to video and it belongs to the Natl Guard. Not being a police officer I am unsure of one thing.. Is it justified to shoot a Guy before you see any type of weapon? Why would a right handed shooter have a gun in his left pocket and then try and do a reach around to get it with the right hand? All of the times we have seen Lavoy on camera he wore a side arm on his right side. I think that he was injured and reaching around for that and then he was gunned down. I doubt that we will ever get the truth.
 
there wasn't anything random about that road block, they were there to catch & take into custody these people.

doing a sit in protest is one thing, taking over a govt building -federal or otherwise- with guns, telling anyone who will listen that you're ready to kill & die, is a whole nuther.

be careful what you ask for, you just might get it.
 
Originally Posted By: Foxpro.223At first It looked unjustified but it is difficult to tell. Why did they have the road block?

Apparently the federals, law enforcers, and a judge invited them to take part in a fake community meeting that was actually just a ruse to coax them out of the Malhuer Wildlife Refudge.

If I recall correctly the young girl stated that they were shot at first as they were driving along in his vehicle and that is why he tried to speed away and drove off the road into the snow bank. If they shot at him first while he was driving along that would make police the aggressors hence him speed away trying to flee serious bodily harm and crashed into the snow bank, he exited the vehicle with his hands up in the air visible, perhaps they continued firing, he was hit in the side which is why his hands came down and they continued to shoot him down.

I'm going to go with the goon squad standing army were the aggressors that time. This is an execution, premeditated homicide.



You were good as you said perhaps they continued firing, and his hands came down because he got hit in the side. I'm with you there, without better definition and sound that allows correlation of when shots were fired in relation to his hands coming down, there are two possibilities, he reached for a firearm, or he was taking fire and got hit, huge difference. If he had his hands in the air giving up, and the cop started firing that is considered self defense to reach for a gun when being fired on in an unprovoked manner. Criminals get off for shooting cops in those circumstances.

I disagree with you being able to come to your decision and judgement that this is murder, it could be but it will take a bit better video to clear it up. I will stay open minded to better evidence.

As a jurist I could go either way depending on whether the case was made that he reached for his gun, or the cop started firing as his hands were ion the air. One is murder the other is a righteous shooting.
 
Originally Posted By: Tbone-AZI watched the video several times.. I saw a man standing in the snow with no one within 10 feet of him. I saw him with his hands up and then it looked like he doubled over, and was clutching at something, and then it looked like someone came running out of the woods and delivered the final kill shot.

I would be very interested to see if he was hit in the side that he clutched. If that is the case it looks like murder.

But, then again I stop and ask myself.. Why are they setting up road blocks, kicking the media out, and arresting people out in the woods in the snow. Is the occupation of a crap little building on a nature preserve really something the FBI needs to be there for? So what if they are there.
Let them sit out there and rail against the government in the snow in the middle of no where. Collecting them up and arresting them, for what? Is what they were doing really at the level of needing to arrest them all, set up road blocks, and deadly force?

If you think it is, then why didn't they do anything like that in ferguson, balitmore, and so on..
They let the ghetto thugs burn the streets and loot and riot.. But a handful of cowboys.. SHoot them.
Better question is why is it when libtards are in office, only ghetto thugs are allowed to protest and the rest are shot.

I agree Tbone. The Feds could have blocked the road to the Refuge center and turned off the power. After a few freezing nights and no food everyone would have just walked out and given up. They had pretty much already made their point. To bad the media won't ever cover the story as to why the Hammonds were put in prison in its entirety. About all the media says is that the Hammonds were arsonists. They will never report the land grab for the mineral rights and the payoff to hillary. This whole thing stinks of government corruption. The LEO's involved were really just dupes for the politicians corruption. I think this is a good lesson in what to expect if SHTF.
 
It is bery hard to tell without sound but the way his hands drops to the one side which is different than the side we have seen him carry in pictures it looks as if he was hit and then the guy comes from behind and finishes him. Looks like murder but hard to be 100% sure as of now.
 
Based on what I've seen, heard and read, and, based on the known corruption in our frd govt. IMO, this was a hit. There will be stonewalling and cover ups among the fed LEO'S involved, and this will not be the last time. And, I am betting, this will never see the inside of a court room.
 
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