why do i need a fancy bow?

the noobie

the noobie

New member
I've been looking into archery hunting and after talking to everyone they say get the best bow you can afford, "you will see the difference"

So about 3 years ago I bought a bow, nothing fancy just a little PSE Stinger. For being unemployed and still in high school it was pretty fairly priced AND onsale. I took the money I saved and invested in nice arrows, arrow rest, sight, and release. All in all I think I have $450 or so invested.

Since then I have taken it into bow shops to have them help me paper tune it and to show me how to do basic work on it, the one day I also asked what the shop owner recomended as far as broad heads. His buddy was also there and his buddies reply was something like "with a bow like that I would stick to rifle hunting." The owner just giggled and then told me muzzy. Didn't help me with 3 or 4 blade or what weight to shoot.

That wholeexperience just ruffled my feathers and since I haven't really done much more than shot the bow a few times. Its been collecting dust so I got wondering what makes bows better than others? I understand where some of these new light weight bows are easier to pack and how a faster arrow would have better stopping power? (Wouldn't it?) But is hunting with my little stinger a lost cause?
 
Noobie What is your draw weight and do you know your speed? I use to work in a achery shop and I know how some dealers are but not all are that way. A good shop would care less about the bow you have and would be more than happy to set up. There really isn't much a difference in a cheap bow vs a high end bow. My favorite bow was a 55lbs compound that shot around 255fps. I was using 100gr muzzys. the bow cost me 200 dollars. my last bow that I bought cost me 1000 dollars. One was faster than the other is the only difference. The best advice to is to shoot the bow and get familiar with it. you will be suprise that the bow you have will shoot just as good as a higher end bow. Just with out the speed.
 
My brother has one and it shoots really well. The first night he brought it to my house after buying it, he was shooting great groups that would put any deer down at 20 and 30 yards no problem. Bow snobs are worse than scope or gun snobs.:) its not a lost cause hunting with it at all. I'm not even close to a bow expert but I know the first deer I shot with a Hoyt that was close to 20 years old didn't know it only cost me $50 when she died.
 
Shoot what you are comfortable with. I know there are people out there that need to have the latest and greatest bow and equipment. I have shot highend bows all the way down to lowend bows. The only difference for the most part is what the bow is made of and the price. I would not get too hung up on what the Mork and his buddy at the shop said. If you know what your bow is able to do and have self imposed limits you will be just fine with what you have. But if you are looking for a reason to buy a new bow then by all means have at it. But take a look at a 1-2 year old bows and shoot alot of different models and brands. I still have and shoot a 2003 Hoyt ultratec but I also shoot a 2011 Hoyt crx35. Love both of them.
 
I had the bow maxed at 60 lbs last time I shot it. When I start shooting again I will probably drop it back a few pounds untill I get used to it again.

I have noticed the bow "elitists" are far worse than rifle/optic elitists. I just flat out quit going to archery talk because if you didn't have the best you wouldn't get helped. I still go back for recurve help but compound I just stick to my other forums.

Even with my apparent "bad" whisker busquit rest 30 yards I could put an arrow where ever I wanted. I never shot groups though because I would damage the veins. 40 yards was where I was still working on but I wasn't quite ready hunting at that distance. 50 yards? Haha I was able to hit the entire target which is a 2'x2' square. I don't know how much I would shake drawing back on an animal but at 30 yards I was shooting good enough to hunt at.

How do you know what your max range is? So if I'm shooting my 60 lb bow with a 100 grain broad head and X amount grain arrow (don't remember arrow weight) what is the furthest range that would be considered an ethical shot? If I got proficient at 50 yards would my bow still be able to make the shot or would I be better off staying down around 35 yards?
 
In my opinion 50 yards is a pretty long shot. your bow would be able to do it as long as it was tuned and you had the ability. 35 yards it's about as far as I really feel comfortable.
 
Practice, practice, practice. Then go and kill a monster muley, or a giant elk and then go rub it in their face! That will get under their skin.
 
noobie, i would say the most important factor for me is shooting time and comfort. As long as your bow functions properly, there is no wrong way to set it up. Id takr a look at multiple sights, peeps and rests and find the setup that you are most comfortable with. Secondly, shoot, shoot, shoot, shoot and shoot!!! When I practice, I like to start at 15 yards and shoot groups til I feel confident I can do it with almost no effort. Then I increase distance in 10 yard increments til i get to 50 yards. I practice at 50-75 yards for a long time, not because I plan on shooting that far, but because anything inside 40 seems super easy after shooting longer ranges. Thats what works for me. Also, a 3d range is a great way to improve your skills and its a great time too. Good luck, that stinger is just fine btw.
 
I read in a magazine that a lot of your shots will be in the 30 yard mark but it was still good to be able to shoot at 50 yards. Like mentioned above even if you don't take a 50 yard shot at an animal that 30 yard shot will be a piece of cake. Out west here I want to try the spot and stalk hunting so a 30 yard shot might be tough to get done. But I don't know that we will have to find out when I actually start hunting.

I need to start shooting again, I wish I could take the bow back to school with me, but there is no storage of bows on campus unless locked in your car. I won't leave anything in my car on a campus full of broke students.

What kind of rests do you guys prefer? I've wanted to try a drop away but I haven't found any reason to get rid of the whisker busquit.
 
First off, no, you don't need a "cadillac bow" to kill deer. Pretty much any bow 35lbs or more with 24" or more draw will kill a deer at 30yrds.

That said, yes, there are distinct advantages to shooting higher quality bows, and for those reasons, I tend to agree with the mentality "buy the best bow you can afford". I would say the same about a rifle, a scope, an E-caller, a truck, pair of workboots, socket set, etc etc.

Cheaper bows are generally less efficient, louder, and rougher drawing (which both hurt efficiency too). They'll also be heavier and generally longer ATA.

Personally, the efficiency of higher quality bows is worth the price. I paid $90 for my first bow, an early 80's model Oregon 80lb, killed dozens of deer with it through high school and college. Then once I had a good paying job, I jumped up to a Solocam, then a z7, and today I shoot a 2011 Bowtech Destroyer 350 and a 2010 Mathews Monster, and my wife runs a 2012 Mathews Jewel 50lb, into each of which I have wrapped up about $1800, not including shafts or heads.

My best friend and my brother in law both run 2012 Diamond Outlaw 70lb's that I played "bowtech" when they were kitting their bows (used to get paid for it, now it's just a hobby). Another buddy just picked up a new Bear Domain that we ran across the Chrony a few weeks ago when we put in his peep site.

Here's a quick comparison of the bows that I have written down in my chrony book:

Diamond Outlaw 70lb x 28": 413grn arrow at 262fps = 63.0ft.lbs.
Daiamond Outlaw 65lb x 29": 375grn arrow at 268fps = 59.8ft.lbs.
Bear Domain 70lb x 27": 408grn arrow at 254fps = 58.5 ft.lbs.
Mathews Jewel 50lb x 24": 360grn arrow at 243fps = 47.2 ft.lbs.
Mathews Monster 70lb x 28.5": 433grn arrow at 277fps = 73.8 ft.lbs.
Bowtech Destroyer 70lb x 28": 393grn arrow at 323fps = 91.0 ft.lbs.

Relatively speaking, the higher priced bows are getting a lot more out of their power strokes than the others.

Drawing the SAME WEIGHT AND LENGTH, I'm getting 50% more energy out of my Bowtech than my buddy gets from his Outlaw, pretty consistent with what the other Outlaw and the Domain are hitting.

What does all that mean? Faster arrows mean better range, and more energy/arrow weight means more penetration for long range kills. My Destroyer has basically twice the effective range of my old Oregon bow, with a lighter draw.

Do you NEED to be able to kill a deer at 70yrds? No. Do I want to be able to? Yes. I don't want to be limited by my equipment, and I can shoot well enough to kill a deer at 70yrds.

That said, I HIGHLY recommend the Diamond Outlaw as a "hunter's bow". Easy to set up, easy to tune, smooth drawing, great price, and pretty dang fast for a $500 bow. But, no, it doesn't stack up to the more expensive Destroyer or Monster.

The Domain (like most Bears) is one of the quietest bows I've shot.
 
Noob
I got my first deer with a $200.00 Wally World bow Just practice don't force your shots and you got more of a reason to get out of bed.Show that punk how you roll
 
I set two stingers up this year. One for my cousin and one for my brother in law both shot excellent out to 40 yards dont know the speed being that chrono wouldnt work. I shoot a bowtech tomkat its 4 or5 years old and it may not be as jice as some of the higher end stuff but its a killer. I shoot regularly at 60 yards thats has far as im gonna try my bow i have shot farther just for fun. For broad heads muzzy can be a pain in the a$$ to get tuned basically your whole bow has to be setup to shoot muzzys nothing wrong with them just spend sometime shooting them. My wife shoots a parker at 50 lbs with mayhem arrows and 100 gr muzzy 3 blade this bow is slow but deadly out to 30 yards. I did put some nice sights and she uses a whisker biscuit the sight are axt 3 pin they run in the 150 range
 
Originally Posted By: the noobieI've been looking into archery hunting and after talking to everyone they say get the best bow you can afford, "you will see the difference"

So about 3 years ago I bought a bow, nothing fancy just a little PSE Stinger. For being unemployed and still in high school it was pretty fairly priced AND onsale. I took the money I saved and invested in nice arrows, arrow rest, sight, and release. All in all I think I have $450 or so invested.

Since then I have taken it into bow shops to have them help me paper tune it and to show me how to do basic work on it, the one day I also asked what the shop owner recomended as far as broad heads. His buddy was also there and his buddies reply was something like "with a bow like that I would stick to rifle hunting." The owner just giggled and then told me muzzy. Didn't help me with 3 or 4 blade or what weight to shoot.

That wholeexperience just ruffled my feathers and since I haven't really done much more than shot the bow a few times. Its been collecting dust so I got wondering what makes bows better than others? I understand where some of these new light weight bows are easier to pack and how a faster arrow would have better stopping power? (Wouldn't it?) But is hunting with my little stinger a lost cause?

There is something in your second from the last sentance, that doesn't equate to bows.
"Stopping Power" doesn't really relate to bows and their ability to kill.
Archery equipment kill by hemorage ( ie, bloodloss)
I'm not trying to get on your case, I don't want somebody trying to convince you your bow doesn't have enough stopping power, so they can sell you something.
#1. Practice and #2, RAZOR SHARP broadheads are what are needed to make clean kills.
I am not to good, but my dad killed truck loads of deer with long bows and recurves. And Razor sharp broadheads were the common denomanator(sp) in every kill.

Good luck, and have fun.
Shayne
 
Sorry I couldn't think of the correct term but won't a faster bow shootheavier arrows and broadheads? And won't those heavier broadheads result in more energy transfered? In turn would cause it to be more traumatizing and lethal?

That's the whole philosophy I took when I got my bow but I figured the nicer release and sight would be better than a more expenesive bow with cheaper pacakge sights and components.
 
Try and get arrows and broadheads that will perform good in your bow. Don't go out and buy heavy arrows or broadheads you won't be happy with your bow. You want arrows that are the correct spine [stiffness] for you bow. If you are to weak the arrow might break in flight. You also don't want to be to far over spined you want some flex in the arrow when it leaves the bow. If you can try to get as much speed out the bow to make a flatter shooting bow. it will perform better for you. you will be much happier.
 
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Also if you sight in at 40 yards at first. The rest of your pins pretty much fall into place. your 20 might need a little adjusting then the rest.
 
Originally Posted By: the noobieSorry I couldn't think of the correct term but won't a faster bow shootheavier arrows and broadheads? And won't those heavier broadheads result in more energy transfered? In turn would cause it to be more traumatizing and lethal?

That's the whole philosophy I took when I got my bow but I figured the nicer release and sight would be better than a more expenesive bow with cheaper pacakge sights and components.

Nothing to be sorry about noobie, just trying to make sure somebody wasn't trying to take advantage of you.

But try to get the idea of trauma (and stopping power) out of your head.
Speed is great as in relation to a deers reaction time, but if your broadheads are super sharp, then penetration and blood loss will be there.
Like I stated before, I am not a great bowhunter, but watched my father harvest deer with a bow 50 years ago.
He never pulled over 45lbs, and with broadheads that you could shave with, would stick the broadhead in the ground after passing through the deer. And that was with longbows and recurves that were extremely slow compared to todays bows.
That is also why I prefer re-sharpenable broadheads, that can be sharpened all the way to the point. I want one that enters by slicing, not by punching a hole.
I also understand there is a difference in the terrain you are hunting. It is hunting in the timber here with short range shots at whitetails that are more than likely smaller bodied than your deer.

So in closing, a light fast arrow with a SHARP broadhead will serve you well.

Good luck
Shayne
 


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