Bolt action vs. AR for predators?

Originally Posted By: rodngunWell I guess since I have been shooting 700's since 67- I'm stuck on em..LOLL

I will take a 700 out of the box- Float the barrel- glass it - do a 3# trigger job - drop a Leupold 4.5-14x50mm and I will go round for round against any AR at 200 yards...



Ummmm.......I don't even know what to say........lol
 
years and years of experience....you need say nothing, but feel free to defend your AR....I'm not hatin ya for it..LOLL
 
I agree it's hard to change when you have been using the same thing for so many years. BUT, I purchased a Remington R25 in .243 last year and installed a timney, decent glass, and handloaded up some 75 v-max and let me tell you that this thing is very very accurate. This thing consistently shoots .5-.7 at 200 yards for me. That might not be good enough to go round for round against you but it sure made me not worry about any accuracy issues. I have taken multiple doubles with this rifle as well as bolt rifles and I will tell you that I think it is easier to do with this R25. Just my opinion though.
 
My Dtech 243 WSSM has shot an inch or under at 200 yards several times. Would I really need more? And I shot bolt actions for forty years.
 
I sure wouldn't play "the accuracy card" in an AR vs Bolt game, as I've seen some very, very accurate AR's and my Remington FVSS wasn't very accurate.

For me, it's still the... wait... WAS the cost issue. Remember, when I bought my Savage 3 years ago, we were at the height of the pre-Obama Gun Scare and AR's were a) hard to find, b) expensive. I'd never heard of all these brands/builds you guys are trotting out. In fact, I'd never heard of them until this thread came along.

If I were to do it all over today, sure, it might be a different story, but to do it today, right now, would mean either spending $$$ or selling my Savage (at a loss, too) and I really don't want to do either just to shoot worthless coyotes. Now, if I could swap my Ruger M77 in .22-250 toward an AR in .223, we might be talking!

So, I'm stickin' with my bolt. At least until I win an AR in the PM Egg Shoot.
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Originally Posted By: Hoier
rodngun said:
Well I guess since I have been shooting 700's since 67- I'm stuck on em..LOLL

I will take a 700 out of the box- Float the barrel- glass it - do a 3# trigger job - drop a Leupold 4.5-14x50mm and I will go round for round against any AR at 200 yards...



I just meant that is the most ignorant thing I've ever heard, you can order a AR from Les Baer that is guaranteed to shoot 1/2 MOA with FACTORY AMMO. So for you to say the word ANY is just plain ignorant.
 
its great to have choices, isn't it.

I bought this CMMG bargain bin for $600 completely built, brand new. It had a small rack mark on the end of the barrel. Had to buy a magazine. Bought a decent Burris mount and a decent scope (Leupold Rifleman). Shot some good factory rounds right out of the box. No fancy after market triggers or free floating barrel, stock rifle. Pretty darn cheap, accurate rifle. Tickle pink.

http://cmmginc.secure-mall.com/item/W.A.S.P.-Bargain-Bin-16-inch-M4-1402

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Originally Posted By: HoierOriginally Posted By: Hoier
rodngun said:
Well I guess since I have been shooting 700's since 67- I'm stuck on em..LOLL

I will take a 700 out of the box- Float the barrel- glass it - do a 3# trigger job - drop a Leupold 4.5-14x50mm and I will go round for round against any AR at 200 yards...



I just meant that is the most ignorant thing I've ever heard, you can order a AR from Les Baer that is guaranteed to shoot 1/2 MOA with FACTORY AMMO. So for you to say the word ANY is just plain ignorant.

I think your taking my words as a confrontation or something- its not - its just my choice.I'm confident in what I shoot and how I shoot..Call it 43 years of hunting or call it from my military background- I have nothing to prove- for you to come up with the term "ignorant" when you know nothing about me - well Sir- you just burnt your bridge !!There is obviously AR's that will shoot sub moa at 200 yards,,,I prefer to do it with my 700's- and yes - I said "ANY" and I stand by that - so fly your custom built AR down here to Texas and we can go head to head - but dont post something like "ignorant" simply becuz your caught up in the AR craze thats going on right now- continue to shoot your AR - and continue shooting yourself in the foot - ZUMBO !!
 
Don't confuse "ignorant" with "stupid" (which would be an insult). You are obviously ill informed/unaware/don't know about (ignorant) of the current state of ARs as to either price or accuracy.

Using your rifle and your handloads you may (or may not) be able to beat someone else who is using an AR, but that's less than useful information as a comparison of ARs to bolts.

Saying a nib 700 is more accurate than a nib AR is just silly. It would be very unusual to find a non-tac AR that didn't shoot sub moa out of the box, with 1/2 moa and better being pretty common with handloads. As has been pointed out, there are several AR manufacturers who guarantee 1/2 moa or better accuracy out of the box. I'm not aware of any factory bolt gun with that guarantee, are you?

Compare apples to apples, measuring the gun, not the shooter.

Take a nib 700, and a nib non-tactical AR (non-chromelined barrel and free float handguard).

Put each of them on a lead sled using identical ammo so you're testing the rifle and not the shooter.

My money would be on the AR every time.

Both AR and bolt require a decent barrel, but given that...

For a bolt gun to be accurate:

*The action has to be as stiff as possible

*The barrel/bore has to be true to the action

*The bolt has to lock up true to the action and the bore

*The stock has to be absolutely ridged and has to hold the action absolutely ridged within it.

Folks spend thousands of dollars having bolt guns reworked (accurized/blueprinted etc) so that all of the above is as true as possible.

You may notice that bolt gun accuracy centers around the action and it's relation to the other parts. In a bolt gun, the action is the heart of the rifle.


ARs are inherently accurate because of their design. There is no action in an AR!! The bolt locks directly to the barrel.

The stock doesn't matter, the barrel/receiver fit doesn't matter, the bolt/receiver fit doesn't matter, the upper/lower receiver fit doesn't matter.

In other words, almost all of the variables that can and do cause inaccuracy in an out of the box factory bolt gun are eliminated in the design of an AR.

CAN a bolt gun be made more accurate than an AR? Absolutely!! With an AR you can put in a good trigger and a custom barrel, and you are basically done. Whatever that got you is pretty much as good as it's going to get.

With a bolt gun you can spend thousands more on accurizing and wind up with a true bench rest gun. I own several 700s that are extremely accurate (now), but straight out of the box they wouldn't have matched ANY of my ARs.

As someone else pointed out, there ARE negatives to the AR platform, but inaccuracy isn't one of them.
 
I guess this is were I am suppose to have some kinda meltdown over you and (obviously) your buddies comments...you can throw out words like "ignorant" and "stupid" all you want to - I wont lower myself to your level - your wasting you time.
 
Originally Posted By: rodngunI guess this is were I am suppose to have some kinda meltdown over you and (obviously) your buddies comments...you can throw out words like "ignorant" and "stupid" all you want to - I wont lower myself to your level - your wasting you time.


You could always go to the eggshoot and from what I seen last year in the pictures their are a lot of AR's you can shoot against just for the fun.
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I am truely a bolt action guy at long distance shooting but the AR does deserve the repect of being the most accurate semi-auto made today. Even a bolt action guy like myself and other are amazed how far they came in a short time and I own 2 AR's and one is a great coyote AR or soon will be. The AR diffently has a place in predator shooting and are fun to shoot and very versitile.
 
WYSONDOG..

You hit the nail on the head !! I'm gonna back out again before I clown somebody - As most can see Ive been on here since 2008.. alot of us dont comment to much for reason like the above crap.. weekend warriors and wanna be know it alls can bring down a board PDQ...So adios ...gonna back out of this one too...let the "EXPERTS" have it ....LOLLLL
 
Yes, come to the Egg Shoot and show all of us weekend warriors and wanna be know it alls!!

Since you don't like ARs, you should be able to sell the one you'll win and make the trip more than worth your while.
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Im a bolt guy & not a fan of AR's But i bought a DPMS 20in bull barrel 223 AR that will shot 5/8in group all day w 50 gr v-max handloads, But i have bolt guns that will eat it alive, The fact is my AR will shoot but so will my bolt guns. So just enjoy hunting and shootin w what u like best.
 
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OOF DA!
I thought the reason a semi-auto in the old days wasn't as accurate as a bolt because the bolt starts coming back when it is fired, are they locked to the barrel till the round it gone?
 
Perhaps the most entertaining thread jack I have ever seen.

Quote:Saying a nib 700 is more accurate than a nib AR is just silly. It would be very unusual to find a non-tac AR that didn't shoot sub moa out of the box, with 1/2 moa and better being pretty common with handloads. As has been pointed out, there are several AR manufacturers who guarantee 1/2 moa or better accuracy out of the box. I'm not aware of any factory bolt gun with that guarantee, are you?


Spot on.

I wonder how long its been since rodngun bought a new Remington 700...
 
I have always wondered why military snipers and competition long range shooters always used bolt action, long barreled rifles.... What a bunch of stupid, idiots!
 
He said on his thread what he'd do to it AFTER he took it out of the box...What else should he do to it? A heavier barrel is one thing. He's got all the scope he needs. What else though? I'm curious? I know a couple of title holders. They might need some advice. Fill me in.

All sarcasim aside... When it comes to predator hunting, I'm gonna say that a coyote won't know wether or not he was hit by a bolt gun or an AR. It's just a matter of personal preferance. I like the bolts.
 
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