Bolt action vs. AR for predators?

Originally Posted By: spiderman I personally take a moment of prayer BEFORE I spray.......Jim
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Thank you for that!!
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Jim
 
I'm left handed shoot left handed and shoot right hand bolts I never have trouble getting on the second dog on a double. although I don't get all of them......Left hand bolts are ugly as all get out.........
 
ok this thread has go me to thinking and looking back at my hunting.....I've killed more doubles, triples and etc. with my bolt action rifles than my ar's by a lot!! Now why? Do I concentrate more with my bolt knowing it'll take a little more for the 2nd shot? or just luck? Don't know but I know I just picked up a sweet 22-250 in a nosler custom, so maybe i'll be back to shooting my bolt action rifles again moreso than my ar's.
 
Originally Posted By: NM_HighPlainsOriginally Posted By: kerstinlinneI really don't see any advantages to a bolt gun since ARs have gotten so accurate.

How sensitive to ammo choice are they, as far as FTF or FTE?

Can AR's fire with the cartridge out of battery?

Is the sight picture thru the scope the same as a bolt gun?

Do the $600 AR's have a trigger as good as the Accutrigger on my $600 Savage?

Just some questions I had....



And I'm still interested in some answers, if anyone wants to chime in.
 
No, the cheap AR's usually have a stock trigger package which is pretty nasty. Some I've had were like 10-12lb pull with tons of creep and over-travel.

I put timney or JP triggers in all of them. That adds a couple hundred bucks to the price tag.

Sight picture is the same, but cheek weld is different unless you get a magpul PRS stock or some other stock with an adjustable cheek.

Most AR's can't fire out of battery... so to speak. However, I've seen stuck firing pins and other things lead to primers getting touched off before the bolt was locked home.

Ammo choice is of concern, but no more than it is in bolt guns. Some AR's can get beat up running heavy bullets, but this is only of concern with the big bores.

As it pertains to coyote hunting, an AR is every bit as capable as a bolt gun. There are some things to be said for the fast follow up shots, thats for sure. However, as with everything in life there are trade off's.

Personally, I hunted primarily with a 16" AR15 223 for the last 8 years or so. I'm migrating back to bolt guns because I don't like the weight of the AR very much. I can build a lighter bolt gun than I can an AR and still maintain accuracy. Also, I can run a much longer barrel in the bolt gun and still maintain the lightness and gain a lot of velocity.

... and that leads us to the main reason I'm transitioning back to bolt guns for coyote hunting. Velocity. I can load up ammo of virtually any variety in a bolt gun and run it very fast without concern of a gas system. This leads to me making shots easier in the field.

Everybody should use what they feel comfortable with.
 
Originally Posted By: NM_HighPlains

How sensitive to ammo choice are they, as far as FTF or FTE?

I've never had a problem with any factory loads, or with my reloads.

Can AR's fire with the cartridge out of battery?

I have no clue if they can, but none of mine have.

Is the sight picture thru the scope the same as a bolt gun?

Yes, unless you have a sight post, and then it's barely visible on lower magnification. It doesn't bother most folks, but I cut the post off one rifle so I wouldn't have to be bothered with it. Most AR's with floated handguards have a flat gas block.
The scope has to sit higher because of the recoil spring through the top of the stock.


Do the $600 AR's have a trigger as good as the Accutrigger on my $600 Savage?

I don't know anything about your triggers, but I have a Rock River in one, and a JP Industries trigger in another one and they are both very good triggers.
Just some questions I had....



Hope that helps.
I've got bolt guns and AR's, and I like both.
 
Originally Posted By: fw707I've got bolt guns and AR's, and I like both.

Me too. I don't see what all the fuss is about. Sometimes I'm in the mood to use one or the other.

Perhaps that is the solution - BUY BOTH and use the one you feel like using at the time!
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Originally Posted By: orkanOriginally Posted By: fw707I've got bolt guns and AR's, and I like both.

Me too. I don't see what all the fuss is about. Sometimes I'm in the mood to use one or the other.

Perhaps that is the solution - BUY BOTH and use the one you feel like using at the time!
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Pretty simple, ain't it??
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Originally Posted By: fw707Originally Posted By: orkan
fw707 said:
Perhaps that is the solution - BUY BOTH and use the one you feel like using at the time!
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Pretty simple, ain't it??
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Only if you have an extra $1000 laying around. I can afford it, but I also have horses, dirt bikes, a Suzuki Samurai, R/C trucks, etc, etc. to spend my money on. I want to spend it wisely.

If you've ever had this happen, you'll ask the question about "firing out of battery":

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This was with a .22 LR. Had it happened with a .223, things might've gotten ugly.
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Originally Posted By: JCI'm left handed shoot left handed and shoot right hand bolts I never have trouble getting on the second dog on a double. although I don't get all of them......Left hand bolts are ugly as all get out.........

I have several right-handed bolts but I do own one left-handed bolt and it looks just like my other Remington's just the bolt is on the other side so I guess I don't understand that one...
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I've had my rimfire AR's fire out of battery all the time.

That is NOT the same bolt design as a regular AR15... so not even worth mentioning in this thread.
 
Originally Posted By: NM_HighPlains
And I'm still interested in some answers, if anyone wants to chime in.


Well, I guess I'm just gullible.
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I thought you honestly wanted some information and I tried to help you out, but all you wanted to do was keep the argument going.

I don't care what you shoot, and I don't care what you "wisely" spend your money on.
 
Originally Posted By: fw707I thought you honestly wanted some information and I tried to help you out, but all you wanted to do was keep the argument going.

I don't care what you shoot, and I don't care what you "wisely" spend your money on.

No, that's not true. I'm sorry if you got that impression.

I guess you're referring to my "if you have $1000" comment. I mean it's easy to say "Oh, just go buy one", but that's a large chunk of money for me to throw around. I just want to make sure that my expectations for an AR are in line with reality. I've bought far too many things that weren't what I expected. And I really hate it when I get something and then everyone says "Now you're going to need THIS" or "You shouldn't have gotten THAT!" Before long, I'm in for way more money than originally planned. That was the point of bringing up all those other "toys"- they're money pits! I don't want any more money pits and so I want to know what it'll really cost to get an AR working and working nicely.

FWIW, I DID get some of the information I was looking for. The comments on the trigger are exactly what I was wondering about and confirm that I'll probably need either a trigger upgrade or a better rifle (.ie RRA, etc) to begin with. Orkan's comment about rimfire OOB vs AR bolts is what I was looking for and I wish I would've known about that sort of thing BEFORE I bought that rifle. So, I did get some of the information I wanted. Besides all that, though, I don't see this as an argument at all, just a discussion with some opposing opinions- nothing wrong with that.

Sorry if you misread me.

 
Originally Posted By: ARDaveI have always wondered why military snipers and competition long range shooters always used bolt action, long barreled rifles.... What a bunch of stupid, idiots!

ARDave: as in "ARKANSAS DAVE", not ARDave as in "AR-15 DAVE"... Now I get it
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! Thats funny...
 
True the stock trigger is not good. However, you do not need to spend $200 on an expensive trigger. There are people who specialize in tuning the stock trigger to be really nice. The RRA two stage trigger is one of my favorites and can be purchased for around 100. You can also tune the trigger by yourself - see ar15.com for several posts on how to do this.

I have an RRA 2 stage - love it. Had a tuned trigger by Bill Springfield - liked it. Have a self tuned trigger - like it. Have a trigger tuned by a local gunsmith - not quite up to the others, but okay.
 
Originally Posted By: TikkaSporterOriginally Posted By: ARDaveI have always wondered why military snipers and competition long range shooters always used bolt action, long barreled rifles.... What a bunch of stupid, idiots!

ARDave: as in "ARKANSAS DAVE", not ARDave as in "AR-15 DAVE"... Now I get it
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! Thats funny...

You got it brotha!
 
Yes indeed. Those of you making excuses about not being able to afford both, and then talking about thousands of bucks in other toys... I have no sympathy and don't care to hear about your plight.

I spend my money on guns, reloading supplies, hunting gear, and gas to go hunting.

Stop doing all that other crap and you'll have plenty of money to spend on guns you want. If not, nobody wants to hear about how you have limited funds because you aren't dedicated to this sport and spend your money elsewhere.

It's a personal problem created by your choices. Live with them happily, or change your choices.
 
Originally Posted By: orkanIt's a personal problem created by your choices. Live with them happily, or change your choices.

Let me explain...

I got into horses because my daughter is a natural horseperson and being that we live on a ranch, it seems like she oughta have opportunity to develop that. I'm not a horseman, but horses are something that we can do together, so I'm doing it.

I got into R/C trucks because one of my boys is severely handicapped and can't do a lot of things that normal boys (like his brother) do. He can do R/C trucks, though, and we can all 3 drive them together. Both boys have developed good mechanical skills from working on their own trucks. At 6 and 9 years old, I'm not quite ready to hand a rifle over to them, although they do help with the reloading and they do go coyote hunting with me.

The dirt bike is mine, but none of my kids are into it and there's no reason for me to be either. It's for sale and it would most likely be the sale of the dirt bike that would fund an AR.

The Suzuki is mine, but I bought it to use as a coyote rig. The kids hate it, so it's also for sale. Nevertheless, it's chewed up a fair amount of $$$ to get it to its current state. It was an experiment that didn't work for us and I'll probably lose $500-600 on it. Should've researched it better.

Buying an AR, on the other hand, would be something for me. I already have a .223 and .22-250 to pass on to the boys and my daughter has a Savage Youth in .223 and .243. If we decided that an AR would be something that someone beside me could use, then we'd get one. But, we, as a family, sit down and decide where our money's gonna go and my purpose now is to what's best for the kids, not what's best for me. I have a college bound teenager coming up on deck and that's making me look harder at these things.

I'm pretty happy with my choices, but who knows?- I'm curious about AR's and that RRA down at the LGS might come home with me tomorrow.

Gotta go brand calves. Later.

 
well i've read this whole thing and have come to this conclusion. both types of guns are capable of putting down coyotes. neither is better than the other. i also know this from hunting with both. as far as mine is bigger than yours well i highly doubt many of the hunters on here can shoot sub-moa on a set of shooting stix at 200 yds. sure most can on a leadsledd at a dot that will be setting there all day waiting. but the original poster didn't ask which was the most accurate he asked bolt v/s AR for predators. the answer my man is they are both quality shooters that will kill predators. some prefer one as opposed to the other. by count i'd say it's half and half. pick both up and feel them and see which is most comfortable to you. only disadvantage to an AR i see is when a landowner sees one he might stereo-type you into a gun nut or a radical nut job or something and it could lose you a spot to hunt. i know it's not fair but it's how it is. sorry for stepping in but i've been off all day due to rain and it makes me nosey.
 
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