Hey Byron, what eastern states did you hunt in "Calling in the East"?

I knew without a doubt that where this video was shot would cause some controversy. I was also aware that most would get hung up on the Texas part. I'm not here to brag about Texas but Texas is a HUGE state. I live on the Eastern edge. If I live in coyote rich environment then why do I travel 6-12 hour West to film my videos. Easy answer. Get a map of North East Texas and lay it next to a map of most any place in the East. Compare human population density, hunter density, terrain features, and many other variables and you will find that there is not much difference. One noteable difference between the far east, like PA, is that they don't quite have the numbers yet and this compounds to reduce your success. My experience in calling eastern coyotes is not limited to East Texas by any stretch. I have hunted in enough places back east to know there is no practical difference in tactics used to be successful. I also have many friends, some of which are on this board that live and hunt coyotes successfully in many of the eastern states, including PA. My intentions are to take this experience and put it on video. This is and expensive venture in which I have absorbed the entire cost. As far as marketing to the "large east coast hunter population $$$". Yes I did. And I may at some point recoupe my investment. But in doing so I will be selling many years of experience for just a few dollars. I am aware the some won't appreciate the effort it took to put this project together. I'm fine with that, because most will look at it with an open mind and then make their judgement.

Hern,
There are places in Texas a "school boy" can call coyotes with a squeaky door, no doubt about that. Consider this, it is closer to the Mississippi River from where I sit and type this, in East Texas, than it is to any prime coyote country in West Texas. Coyotes don't have a map they don't know where PA is, WA state, or E. TX. they adapt their behavior to survive in whatever habitat they make home. I understand this. There is a stark difference in calling unpressured coyotes on large ranches in West Texas or anywhere for that matter than there is calling pressured coyotes in tight timber. Don't make it harder than it has to be. It's still just a coyote.

Byron
 
The one thing that makes it easy to call in any one area is the lack of cover.Not population density. Why do I make such a statement? It's simple really, when you limit the amount of cover you limit areas where coyote's travel and bed. You drive along a ranch road and the brush choked aroyo stands out over the grassy plain. It provides water and cover. Same here in western Ky where they crop from fencerow to fencerow.The tiny woodlots of 3 acres or so stand out as well as the creek banks making it easy to choose calling sites. Cover dictates where the coyote will be.

Now lets change your scenario. Big timber everywhere along with hills and hollows. Dozens of steep hillsides covered in thickets with small flat crop or pasture fields.Cover is everywhere! How do we find them? Here in the east two factors come into play, weather and human pressure.Water and cover are no longer our factors governing where they hide out.Our big factor is human pressure they have to find an area where tehy can rest without being disturbed. Weather involves heat and cold winds, they must find protection from both. This is where the winds and terrain provide our clues.

In the summer they must have some relief from the heat. This means shade and circulating winds.North or NW facing slopes that have a crosswind from the predominant direction for your area are the most likely places.The soil is naturally cooler along these slopes helping to cool them.

In winter this changes. They must have heat from the sun and protection from the bone chilling winds our humidity creates. Southern exposures, preferably a hollow that faces due south, is the key here. This protects them from the northerly winds. The stronger the winds the steeper the slopes of this hollow must be. Food supplies are dwindling as the winter moves on and staying warm gets harder with each passing day. The air in this hollow has to be almost completely calm.

Topo maps and airial phots are great aids here. These show you the travel lanes, terrain features and human habitation.Scout for sign to show general directions of travel.This is how you eliminate the dead ground. Factor in time of year and weather conditions. Then its a matter of checking all the likely spots you can get too. Jimmie
 
Byron,

No controversy with me. Some of you southern & Western coyote hunters. Seem to have good populations of coyotes per sq. mile. As per coyotes called per stand, from what I've seen & read anyway.

I'm not saying they are "dumber" coyotes. But it appears to me. A caller has better odds of coyote/per stand, on some of those ranches, with large plotted [sq. mile] hunting areas. As compared to heavily wooded or small land sections. That are cut up every sq.-mile or so, with roads & farms & noise.

---------

Jimmie,

My area's are almost completely wide-open rolling cropland hills. Cut up by gravel roads, every 1-sq. mile. Also each sq.-mile might have a dozen or more small farms on it.

Which varies quite abit from yours, as you state. There are some small tracts of timber interspersed, as well. But the coyotes are [almost]...always, out in the open on the sides of hills. And occasionally on the lower hillsides.

They appear to only use the timber. When it's sweltering or a blizzard, around here.

It seems to me, although they are coyote. They have, IMO adapted to their different regional-environment's quite well. As well as adapting somewhat different behaviors to match.
 
Jimmie,

Your a wise man, and no doubt deadly on coyotes. Coyote hunting is alot like bass fishing, you have to find the structure that most likely hold the bass and fish there. You can't go out in the middle of the lake and just start casting around and hope to catch as many bass as a man that understands bass and where they hang out. Once you understand where coyotes/Bass hang out you must then cast them the bait/call into this structure and get them to come out. Not all bass take the bait and not all coyotes will come to the call. But none will come if they can't hear it.

Byron
 
Kirby,

Go to terraserver and find Upshur County Texas or Gilmer, Texas. What you will find is lots of small tracts of land cut up into mostly 10-40 acre tracts of over hunted property. You will also not find many "square mile" tracts. What you will find is a network of county roads that meander through some of the thickest woods found anywhere on the planet. Not much of my neck of the woods is left untraveled. It is rarely over 1/4 mile in any direction to a road or a house. We have very long hunting seasons and lots of squirrel hunters, bow hunters, and rifle hunters that overhunt just about every available tract of land available. The success rate hear in East Texas is so low that some have gone to driveing out west to do their hunting. Most coyote hunter here quit within a year because of low success. A few, like me, have hung in there and learned what it takes to call them. Our coyotes are shot and shot at on sight by every deer hunter, farmer or land owner to the point that what coyotes survive become very reclusive and almost strictly nocturnal. In fact you will rarely hear one howl unprovoked before midnight. They have learned to keep a very low profile, so to speak. I have read your post on spotting and stalking coyotes. That would be a low precentage tactic in this neck of the woods.

I've enjoyed this debate.

Byron /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
Byron,

Yep...discussion = Good! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif...Anger = Bad, /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/frown.gif .


Hmmmm, BTW...I've been known to lob a few mortar rds, a quarter mile on rare occasion's /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif
 
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i never got mad .

you say you know someone that
successfully in many of the eastern states, including PA.

if this is true let me here who is successfully harvesting coyote here in PA I NEED PHOTOS AND NAMES.

NOT BY DOG OR BY MISSHAP WHO IS HARVESTING COYOTE HERE WITH A CALLER SUCCESSFULLY

I WILL WAIT FOR PHOTOS AND A NAME.................


Jimmy from ky
when you were hunting here were did you hunt at??????
 
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Byron, I think you've made a huge territorial mistake here bud, you have just described NW GA. to the tee ! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif
hehe.......this thread has definitely been a informative read ! Looking forward to the release of your new video. Thanks to those that have contributed here. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
Jeb




Quote:
Kirby,

Go to terraserver and find Upshur County Texas or Gilmer, Texas. What you will find is lots of small tracts of land cut up into mostly 10-40 acre tracts of over hunted property. You will also not find many "square mile" tracts. What you will find is a network of county roads that meander through some of the thickest woods found anywhere on the planet. Not much of my neck of the woods is left untraveled. It is rarely over 1/4 mile in any direction to a road or a house. We have very long hunting seasons and lots of squirrel hunters, bow hunters, and rifle hunters that overhunt just about every available tract of land available. The success rate hear in East Texas is so low that some have gone to driveing out west to do their hunting. Most coyote hunter here quit within a year because of low success. A few, like me, have hung in there and learned what it takes to call them. Our coyotes are shot and shot at on sight by every deer hunter, farmer or land owner to the point that what coyotes survive become very reclusive and almost strictly nocturnal. In fact you will rarely hear one howl unprovoked before midnight. They have learned to keep a very low profile, so to speak. I have read your post on spotting and stalking coyotes. That would be a low precentage tactic in this neck of the woods.

I've enjoyed this debate.

Byron /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

 
George, we have to consider just how new the sport is here in the east. When you check around the majority of us that post to this board are weekend warriors just like yourself. We have learned what the factors for coyote habit are in our area. The coyote is as paranoid as they come and it shows in every habitat it calls home. There may or may not be anyone there that has spent as much time and devotion to the sport we have. I personally haven't met anyone who has on any board. All we can give you are the basics of coyote behavior. Everyone has to figure out what factors affect that behavior where they live.

I think you misunderstood me. I have never hunted in Pennsylvania. I have hunted all over western Ky from the Mississippi to the Green river. The changes in terrain and habitat in this area alone are astounding. Open areas similar to Iowa and mountainous terrain that sucks the air right out of your lungs.All these diferences make changes in the winds and other factors that affect coyote behavior in that place and time. Go to terra server and look up these places,Arlington, Fancy farm, Pottsville, Marion, Shady Grove, Cayce, Princeton and Land Between the Lakes Ky. This covers both farm country and the hardest hit public lands in the region.Look at both airial photos and topo maps. Compare them to areas in your neighborhood. Somewhere in all of that you can find something you can relate to. When you do holler at me and we will discuss what I found to affect them in those areas.


Kirby, I tend to get long winded at times and used those two examples for brevity. You would not be surprised at some of hte places I find them at all. It all comes down to what causes that behavior in that place at that time.I would be willing to bet good money , that when you find them out on those hillsides the temps and winds are the biggest factor. They like to be comfortable as they can get and that particular spot fills that need at that time.Always question why they do what they do and check it out for yourself and see if you can figure it out.We as humans often complicate things with our thoughts. Animals just act on instinct and self preservation.

Thanks for the compliments Byron. I can understand the frustration caused by this east verses west thing. I used to think the same way many years ago.Eventually all will come to understand that coyote habit and nature dictate what it does where ever it lives.Jimmie
 
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This is getting ridicules,

First off I think your thoughts on what to do to hunt coyote here is way of base.
Comparing coyote to bass .lol

So it really starting to sound like we just are doing something wrong. If that what you saying. Cause that’s what it sounds like.

The old if I had the time I would show you think,

Well that’s not the cases.

first let me say this Pennsylvania sells more resident hunting lic then any other state
we have the most public land in the USA.
We have the largest black bear in the world and I would bet the largest elk.

Now I just told ya that over 4.000 hunters hunt a 2 day contest here with dog and pushing
And calling .
And there was only 100 or so coyote harvest with like 40 were by calling.

But you still going to give pointers on what we should do!!!
Give me a brake.

Know some of you have been here and tried with no success .
And some of you that are trying to give advice to guys that been doing this for 35 to 30 years have never encountered or tried to hunt a eastern coyote………

It this all started because I was under the impression the new video was titled
Calling in the east. That all

And all I am saying is that if its titled calling in the east them it is very misleading
And almost sound like it suppose to be misleading because not 1 guy out there would think it east Texas .

that all I am saying not looking for a lessen in how to hunt coyote from a guy that never don’t it here and I don’t know any thing about him.

Byron I will say this I am one of your biggest fans pal and as one of your biggest fans
I would hope you wouldn’t let me down that’s all

I watch this tapes for the kill shot any way and don’t care were they are filmed
But there are a lot of guy looking for a true calling in the east tape


LOVE George /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
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weekend warriors
jimmie just so you know son ,
I am a full time outfitter,
And most of the hunts I do are predators with over 40 hunters a year for predators in camp.
I have over 250,000 acres in Texas.
1 camp in NC and 1 in PA
I am field staff or pro staff for many outdoor products
1 being Loudmouth game calls
Now as fare as it being new pal we have been calling and killing them here in pa since the late 50s




DADSCOYOTE.jpg



HERE ARE SOME MORE PHOTOS FROM THE LAST 3 YEARS I CAN PUT MAYBE MORE IF YOU LIKE /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif

http://photobucket.com/albums/v47/G.ACKLEY/
 
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Goerge, It was not intended to ruffle your feathers.If I did I apologize.

Like you my first coyote seen was many years ago by accident mostly. The sport of calling is new to most in the east and it's causing problems for those of us interested in it. In the 80's there were not a dozen of us calling here in Western Ky. When I moved to this farm I was the only one in a fifteen mile radius. Today I have a dozen callers within four miles of my home besides myself.Add that more than twenty houses have been built in that same four mile radius in that time not to mention the rest of the county.This past winter one group of eight animals was all but wiped out, a lone female survived. I got only one of them myself. This is pressure of unbeilievable proportions!

This same thing is happening in your state too.It's made major changes in what I do now over what I did then.It's made huge changes in how the animals travel and when.And yet the coyote population is still growing by leaps and bounds.I have to change sounds and calls I use and have to walk a little farther each year.

That little female mentioned above mated. I know because I was out there listening to it happen. She called for three days before she shut up. Her pups are going to be a new challenge because she will teach them to survive in an area where her fellows did not. This is what we are dealing with and we have to figure out how to meet the challenge.

I would very much like to see some of the areas your working. Give me something to eyeball and we can discuss what we see.Jimmie
 
Byron,
I consider the title of your video misleading, false advertisement and I don’t think it is fair to the people that purchase the video. I have enjoyed your videos and would have bought this one too but I am starting to think twice about it. East Texas is not the Eastern USA, does not mater if the terrain is similar or not. I think U R after --> $$$$$. Just my 2 cents
 
No doubt about it I am buying it . I watched the fox pro post that went up this week 20 times /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif lol

Just would of like it with a different name

he is a grate guy with a grate poduct /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif,


besides if him and jimmie didn't talk with me nobody would /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif
 
Byron & Jimmie,

I did check on Terra. You have some nice coyote habitat down there. Can't really tell how hilly or flat that country is. But looks like it can maintain a healthy population.

What really interests me. Is the number of coyotes called per day or stand. As compared from one region to another. Say, both regions have similiar populations. How come callers from some states & or regions. Consistantly see more coyotes called in, per stand or days called?

I have yet to meet or read about an Iowan coyote caller. Who has "ever" called in a handfull or more coyotes. On any given day, let alone per stand. I'm talkin about [consistantly]...Regardless, of time of year. Perhaps, it has happened. But I'd say an extreme rarity indeed. As compared to Southwestern & Western callers.
 
George,

No one has questioned your ability or implied that you were doing something wrong, in fact, I respect you for the experience you have brought to this board. I have never intended to mislead anyone with anything I have ever done. What makes you think I would start now? I have been to PA, in fact, when I was there I was amazed at how similar the terrain and demographics were to E. TX. Also while I was there PA received the largest flood rains it had received since 1972. Can we agree I had less than favorable weather conditions for calling coyotes.

I didn't fall off the turnip truck last night either. I've been calling critters for lots of years and been fortunate enough to share stands with some of the legends in the calling world, I'm not saying this to boast, but to say I have a little knowledge and experience with coyotes. Not just stupid Western coyotes either. I have hunted coyotes in 11 states most in the West but a few in the East and have a pretty good grasp on what it takes.

You gave all the stats on PA but left out the fact that PA probably also has one of the the lowest population of coyotes of any state in the union. As far as me knowing people in Pa that are successful, I most certainly do, but have none of their pictures and will not broadcast their names over the internet without first asking. If you need proof to know that I'm telling the truth then I guess you can just call me a liar. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

I don't want to argue with you George and I'm certainly not trying to pull the wool over anyones eye's. I simply put a video together with tips and tactics that work for me while hunting very spooky, high strung, paranoid coyotes, in thick terrain. Hey!!!! maybe that's what I will call it. Lets see, but don't that sound like an eastern coyote to you. Maybe not. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif

cbgc,

Thanks for your input and for what it's worth I do hope I make money with this project. I have invested plenty to do so. That being said if it fails it will because of it's content and not the name on the cover. Likewise it will succeed because of the same. No one is being mislead and in fact I haven't even done the cover or determined a final name for this video. I will admit I was kicking around the title "Coming to the Call goes East" and "Calling in the Thick Stuff". After this thread I beleive I will call it the later. BTW, Welcome to PM! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif

George, that FX3 footage was shot north of Ft. Worth and won't be on this video, but will be on the next video. It will be out shortly as well. Sure hope I make some money on that one as well. Is that so evil? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused1.gif

Byron
 


I've only been at this yote hunting since Jan 2005 with this board as my only teacher, no video's or mentors, and only called in a "pack" ( 5-6 dogs ) close enough too shoot 1 time at night that were so close my partner got scared and started screaming, they about run him over and he never lifted his gun.

I have yet to call a coyote in during daylight, but we have called in 2 bobcat while coyote hunting during dawn and evening almost seemed easier ????

I have yet to harvest my first yote but I can taste how close I am.....

I have TONS to learn and if I could afford it I'd be hunting more states and taking more trips but things are tight...very tight...so I make do with what I got here in NEPA.

The yotes here seem to know you're out there...wind in your face or not.
( oh, I did get 1 with the car by accident this Jan, cost me a headlight lmao )

This has been an interesting read none the less, I believe I have learned a bit more, and a dream I have is to be in the first PA Yote Video. Just a dream....:):):) I'm working on it !!!!!!!! lol I eat sleep and drink Yote hunting..my wife thinks I'm nutz, the feelings I have about it remind me of archery and turkey hunting as a kid.

Think I took and twisted the topic all up...lol

Basically all I wanted to say is I even learned a little bit more than I knew before from this post.

Vic
 
I hope you make a million pal .
like I sad you are 1 hell of a guy and not just hunting.
I always sad that you are still there to talk to .as big and famous as you are.
and that mean a lot to the hunter that watches you tape
many times I have sad ( I know that guy talk to him all the time)

and if any one could harvest a coyote here in PA it would be you.

And you can give out one guys name that is successful here that you know
It me George Ackley /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.

But we were talking about are coyote and how we feel they are and are not different not tactics on killing them .

It's hard to swallow some one saying
(that you should try this) it will work there only coyote.
when we are here trying every thing and everything any one can think of

And yes maybe I have to get to my ranch down south in Laredo
and smoke some coyotes to recharge my batteries .

Because I am telling you I have been getting testy the last couple week.

But 1 thing we can always talk and see things in a different way
and still be buddies on line. You use a foxpro and I have never teased you about that /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

So please don't ever take any thing to hart.

look at the guys that are saying they are picking things up from this post . right

we are just talking. AND THATS WHAT IT ALL ABOUT HERE RIGHT

And talk is good.
so just keep the videos coming AND I WILL LEAVE OUT THE FOXPRO JOKES /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/tongue.gif
 
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Glad to hear it Vic. Let us all know when you connect, and please take pictures. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif

George,

I was just looking at Terra server and I'm almost closer to you in PA than to Laredo /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif. I don't take to much of this internet stuff serious until my intentions are misread. Then It frustrates me more than angers me /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif. I know your a solid guy(no pun intended) and value your input. I'll bet if you got yourself a new call you may even call more coyotes /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/wink.gif(pun intended) /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grin.gif. When I get back to PA I'll come by and show you what your doing wrong /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif.(more pun intended). Hang in there George, and thanks for the support. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif

Byron
 
George, you would be surprised at the accidents I have that are succesful. The creation of that whipped pup was one of them. I was scouting and working a piece of new ground one afternoon with winds higher than one needs to be calling in.I knew the sounds I was using were not carrying at all.

I had been practicing with The new prototype of Rich Cronks killer Jr. getting some really great sounds out of it.Came across a spot where two thickets, a corn field , with a pasture for backing all came together. Sitting right above a perfect travel lane, brush choked ditch. Wind was blowing out into the cornfield which was down wind of me, my scent blowing along the edge.

Spot was perfect and I could feel it. I needed a shrill high pitched sound that would carry in that wind. I started with a series of pup yelps as loud as I could and as a second thought went right into grey fox distress. I had just finished the second series when movement coming in caught my eye. It was headed straight for the opening to the corn field in front of me where it could get my scent. A slight twitch of the rifle barrel and a trigger squeeze and she was down at twenty feet from me.

I skinned her as darkness fell and walked straight line back to the truck in the dark for 30 minutes. I was two miles from it and at least a mile from the road itself.

I've repeated that little accident way to many times for it to have been a fluke. So much so that an attempt has been made to get it on a loudmouth caller.

Sometimes we have to throw away what we think we know and create a scene in our minds and the coyote's mind. What they really think is going on I don't know. But I do know they come at a run or a fast trot to that sound. Sounds out of the ordinary a getting to be what it takes to trip a coyote's trigger. A technique you normally would not risk because of the setup.

I'm working on another scheme for the big timber of the LBL and those smart alec dogs there.Thank goodness they don't care what sound I use or it would get really dificult;-)Jimmie
 
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