What you don’t know about ADC

i have miles and miles of blm and state land here in wyoming and i call it alot but the ranch that started this whole thing is ran by a guy who is vary pro hunter he lets me and others go the the leases he has control of the hunting on as far as big game. and lets coyote hunters on all leases he owns some of the land out there but not much its mostly leased land.
the main reason i choose to go to b.b. brooks is that its 6 miles from town and 8 miles from my house to the first call location.
i love to call coyotes or elk if elk worked all year long my coyote calling would be serious cut back.
i don't have to kill coyotes but i'm addicted to calling them. i kill them because i don't wont call shy coyotes.
i'm going to keep calling, there for i'll keep shooting them too.
dean never offered a bounty on coyotes but if he needs electrical work done he calls me. win win situation.
dean has leases all around casper am i'm welcomed on to every inch.
scott's on the other hand will let you hunt deer,antalope,elk and birds but will not let you hunt coyote,fox or lion or bobcat.
they say if you leave them alone the regulate themself better then man can.
most ranchers don't see it that way but its thair land so be it.
forgies let me call but i never go to all most all of the ranch because of jarards place is next to it and i don't know the boundery well enough.
on forgies i stick to just the omni tower pasture that way i stay safe.
bill owens let me call but i could not find a good trail to stay out of sight. the roads all follow the ridgeline and there wasn't anywhere i could get the truck out of sight. the area is to big to do good on foot. i also was afraid of the bounderys with coopers and the navil oil reserve.
i pick my calling areas 1.close to home 2. ease of area to stay out of sight 3. high dencities of coyotes.
i don't wont to drive over 50 miles to the first stand this saves gas and lets me go more often.
i like the omni tower road its built just under the crest of the hill with rolling hills on the other side makes it easy to get in and out unseen. i call it my 10 o'clock run i can go out at daylight in the winter make 4 to 5 stands and be home at 10 and useually see or at least hear coyotes.
when the wind is down i'll call if the wind is blowing i scout.
this whole ranch has lots of coyotes and is the 3rd best place i have ever called.
one place was bought by a texan who wont let me hunt. it was the best calling i ever had access to.that ranch was part of b.b. brooks befor ed sold that part and was where i got all the coyotes my best year.
10 called in coyotes was common, killed was a different story but i killed some every trip.
worst thing was just a year or two after he sold it he was killed in a car crash.
lots of things keep us calling i think coyotes are the most challanging thing to hunt that is why i like it so much and they are the only thing i still like to hunt with a rifle i prefer bowhunting big game.
 
"QUOTE"
Coyotes are opportunistic killers. That means they will take the easily available sick, weak, and wounded. Healthy animals are normally only targeted by territorial adults. These older coyotes are usually the one's responsible for killing (healthy) livestock. The longer a coyote lives in and dominates an area, the more likely he will eventually build up the courage and learn how to kill sheep. Even so, a pair of coyotes can live near sheep and never bother them. But if those non-threatening coyotes are removed, other coyotes may move into that area and start killing. Blindly killing all coyotes in an area can very easily make the problem much worse.
"QUOTE"

“Kill ‘em all” is often used as a "preventative" to reduce (total) local coyote populations before any livestock losses occur. As a result however, coyotes who would never attack sheep are killed along with those who might actually cause problems.

Not all coyotes attack livestock, even when no other prey is available. Killing a coyote who has no interest in attacking livestock creates a vacant territory that will quickly be filled by a nearby coyote or dispersing younger animals. This new coyote may cause problems that would have been averted by allowing the original resident to remain and defend its territory.

READ THESE TWO QUOTES CAREFULLY! I SEE SEVERAL DISCREPANCIES HERE! FIRST YOU SAY THAT IT IS GENERALLY THE REALLY OLD TERRITORIAL COYOTES THAT DO THE KILLING,THEN YOU TURN AROUND AND SAY THAT IF YOU REMOVE A PAIR THAT WILL NEVER KILL THE LIVESTOCK THAT THEY MAY BE REPLACED BY LIVESTOCK KILLERS! {GIVE ME A BREAK HOW CAN ANYONE STATE ,THAT ANY COYOTE WILL NEVER KILL LIVESTOCK}



IF YOU LEAVE THEM THERE LONG ENOUGH {EVEN THE NONE LIVESTOCK KILLERS} WONT THEY EVENTUALLY REACH THE OLD AGE STATUS MAKING THEM TERRITORIAL THUS THEY WILL LIKELY BECOME "HEALTHY LIVESTOCK" KILLERS ACCORDING TO YOUR STATEMENTS ABOVE!





I WOULD LIKE TO POINT OUT THAT ALL OF THIS IS OPINION OF EITHER THE ADC GUYS OR HUNTERS,I PERSONALLY HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THE ADC GUYS GETTING PAID TO DO WHAT THEY LIKE TO DO,LIKEWISE I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH HOBBYISTS/HUNTERS DOING WHAT THEY LIKE TO DO SO LONG AS IT IS LEGAL .

ONE LAST THING SO LONG AS PEOPLE ARE GOING TO COMPARE FIREMAN TO WAL-MART EMPLOYEES {WHICH I PERSONALLY CONSIDER BOTH TO BE HONORABLE JOBS}

LET ME ASK YOU THIS ,YOUR KIDS/GRANDKIDS ARE PLAYING IN A SAND BOX AND THERE IS A 6 FOOT RATTLER LAYING THERE JUST SUNNING ,NOT TRYING TO BITE OR RATTLING MADLY JUST MINDING HIS OWN BUSINESS, HE MAY LIVE THERE HIS WHOLE LIFE AND NEVER BE A HUMAN BITTER,WHAT ARE YOU GOING TO DO? WAIT TILL HE BITES THE KIDS TO DECIDE HE'S A PROBLEM AFTER ALL HE WILL JUST BE REPLACED BY ANOTHER ONE IF YOU KILL HIM AND IT MAY BE A HUMAN BITER!

JUST MY .02
 
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I'll be damned:) you know, for some reason, right before I typed that, I had a gut feeling you weren't a beer drinker, but then thought, naw, he's a Texan:)
Goes to show, your first hunch about someone, is probably the right one.
 
Nah, Glenn is more of a wine cooler and Zima type of guy. That beer does nothing for those girly hips! Take of them glasses Glenn and show us that eye shadow! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

That should lighten the mood, FOR A MINUTE! /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smiliesmack.gif

Todd
 
yuk! I tried a wine cooler once had heartburn for three days!
Todd
I knew you had a secret admiration for my backside! you bad boy you! now I know why unle Jay says uncle Todd and aunt Jeff!
 
I'm still interested in reading opinions on my scenario, I previously posted on this thread.


Would, that pinned "non-sheep killing or sheep carcass eating, coyote". Kill & eat that lamb? Or starve to death?
 
Quote:
I'm still interested in reading opinions on my scenario, I previously posted on this thread.


Would, that pinned "non-sheep killing or sheep carcass eating, coyote". Kill & eat that lamb? Or starve to death?



Yes he would. Why? Self preservation, simple as that.

But that really has nothing to do with real life where the coyote may have easier or preferred choices. I've never been around sheep except for at livestock shows but I have seen a cow or two and I have seen coyotes walk right through a calving herd looking for afterbirth and picking through cow pies. I have also seen them try to get at a new calf, you just can't tell what they'll do. No different than the neighbors dogs some will run them some won't, problem is coyotes all look alike.

Just my non-professional opinion, worth every penny you paid for it. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-006.gif
 
Quote:
I have seen coyotes walk right through a calving herd looking for afterbirth and picking through cow pies. I have also seen them try to get at a new calf, you just can't tell what they'll do. No different than the neighbors dogs some will run them some won't, problem is coyotes all look alike.



/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/bowingsmilie.gif You are correct. They all look alike, but they do not all act alike. But it's no simple task for our untrained eye to tell one actor from another on a day to day basis. Nothing we should feel ashamed about, just a fact of life. I want to learn more about how the ADC pro's are able to make this distinction. If they can learn to do it, then so can I. And I want to learn. The more I know, the more I can pass on to keep this sport alive.
 
No, but that doesn't surprise me.

Rob Meyers gave a reference in the other thread, "Anyone that wants to learn more about ADC..should get Craig O'Gorman's Animal Damage Control tape...that will give you an idea how it works... ".

Just one of the nuggets buried in there. /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/grinning-smiley-003.gif
 
Size-up, people do it. So do animals, comes naturally IMO.

I've had my share of stand-offs with aggressive domestic dogs. The ones that rushed in & bit me or tried to. No doubt quickly sized me up & thought, they could dominate/whip me. While other's looped around, wanting me to break & run.

Some yrs ago an early Sunday morn, just got off duty. Decided to take the long way home. While driving down the main loop. I seen a group of cars, driving very slowly in a 35mph area. None stopped.

As I drove nearer, I seen a very little girl. Standing on the shoulder of the 4-lane street. She was being closely circled by a large aggressive Black Lab.

As I drove, slightly past them & pulled over. The little girl was stiff with fear while weeping silently. Afraid to move. While the dog drew nearer, baring his teeth.

I thought, [stay right there Bucko]. I stuck my 6" fishing filet knife in the back of my uniform. Walked towards the dog, making hard eye-contact. Wanting to give him some bad, as rage set-in.

Male dog backed off, right away. He knew.
 
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I am new to predatormaster and am kinda in shock about this whole pro vs. rec hunter. If you are good enough to sit down, call in a yote, and KO him, you are a pro. Whether you get paid or not. If me calling in a "problem" coyote causes a "pro" to not be able to put food on the table, then maybe that person might look into a new job. You don't stop hunting a big buck just because there is another hunter in the woods and you really can't do anything about it if you both have permission to be there. It just turns into a little friendly competition. It seems to me like the rec hunters are whooping the pros and the pros are claiming the whole "your messing up my livelihood and causing a mess of the coyotes," card, simply because they are being out done by the average guy that knows more than they do about what they are getting paid to know about.
 
I have a question that may ruffle some feathers, but I will ask it anyway. Why does it matter if you go out to kill a yote that some rancher wants killed, and you kill the wrong one? I understand you may not know whether or not you ever got the problem yote, but so what? Now, I know you dont need to brag that you did kill the problem yote, cuz you can never really be sure if you come after the fact of whatever incident triggered the request, since the only way to know for sure is catching them in the act. And maybe thats the issue here, If a rancher asks me to take out a yote for him that he thinks did this and that, I will, but I wont promise him i without a doubt got the right one. But, I dont think there is anything wrong with killing some of the other yotes that may be in the area. If it pleases the rancher and gets me some hunting time, then thats good for us both.





...if this has already been mentioned and i missed it, my apologies.
 
i couldn't agree more. The ADC guys can't guarantee that they got the problem coyote either. If a rancher tells me he has some yotes that he wants taken out, i'll take out all i can as long as i can.
 
quote:
They all look alike, but they do not all act alike. But it's no simple task for our untrained eye to tell one actor from another on a day to day basis. quote:

NASA, glad you got my point. The other side of the coin is they may change their behavior as conditions get worse or better.

I know 2 gov trappers and I pick their brains every chance I get because I want to learn everything I can about coyotes and coyote hunting. It's a shame that some of the "pro's" who frequent this board aren't more accessable, I know they have a ton of knowledge but not everyone can "teach" what they know nor can everyone understand everything that is taught. I fit both of those categories unfortunately.
 


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